Mon
Nov 7 2011 1:00pm
Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2: Apples, and Curses, and Bears, Oh My!

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2It’s Week 2 of the Battle of the Network Fairy Tale Shows, where the real winner is genre television! Once Upon a Time hones in on the motivations of its most sinister character, while Grimm introduces us to a new breed of creature as it teaches us a valuable lesson about not eating other people’s food or sleeping in their beds.

So, how did Once Upon a Time and Grimm’s sophomore efforts fare this week? Clicken-zee! And beware the spoilers.

 

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Once Upon a Time, Ep 2: “The Thing You Love Most”

Emma Swan (Jennifer Morrison) has decided to stay in Storybrooke for a week as Henry (Jared Gilmore) requested, still not convinced that what he’s told her about the fairy tale nature of Storybrooke is true, but wanting to make sure Henry is all right. This displeases Regina (Lana Parilla) immensely, and she does just about everything in her power to get rid of her. Emma is not easily bullied, however, and she proves a worthy adversary. The modern scenes are balanced out by flashbacks having to do with Evil Queen, and the lengths to which she was willing to go in order to acquire the Dark Curse, illuminating not only a surprising connection between Henry and Regina, but the nature of the relationship between Regina and Mr. Gold, aka Rumpelstiltskin.

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Script (2): After a flawed pilot, OUaT rebounded and went from zero to AWESOME in a week. Adam Horowitz and Edward Kitsis have figured out their groove, and the modern and fairy tale halves of the show complimented each other this week in a way they didn’t last week. I probably shouldn’t keep comparing the show to Lost, but as the writers and the flashback device are the same, I’m gonna. The glimpse we’re provided of the Evil Queen’s backstory felt like a Lost flashback, and that’s a good thing. It gave us all the character and story information we needed to enjoy and understand the modern half without doing so at the expense of suspense.

And boy did that suspense pay off! Just when you thought you got a great shock (The Evil Queen killed her own father to sacrifice his heart and acquire the curse!), you were blindsided by another one (Henry is her father!). And just as you’re getting over THAT, there’s the revelation that Rumpelstiltskin actually does remember his life before the curse, and can hold that over Regina’s head at any time with one simple word: “Please.”

Another thing I have to praise about the writing is that Regina’s true intentions are never telegraphed in the script. We never have a modern moment of her being all “Ha, ha! My plan is working!” Even as Rumpelstiltskin is pointedly referring to her past, she never says a thing, which only makes the moments in which she either gets what she wants, or she’s thwarted, all the more powerful. Helpful, too, is the fact that the Evil Queen’s dialogue never slips too far into modernity, even in her slightly campy scene with Maleficent.

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Performances (2): Lana Parrilla owned this episode, infusing both the Evil Queen and Regina with a touching humanity. She plays a woman who would kill her father to get what she wants, and yet you understand that she loved him deeply, and are forced to acknowledge that there is a reason why she was driven to such devastating sadness. Jennifer Morrison continues to shine as Emma, and the scene in which she cuts down Regina’s apple tree rocked. I was also happy to see True Blood’s Kristen Bauer van Straten as an intriguing version of Maleficent. She, too, made a character that could have easily been made a caricature human. And Jared S. Gilmore is growing into his role as Henry, bringing both humor and depth to the role. Robert Carlyle remains creepy as hell.

Production (1.5): There was some beautiful work in the fairy tale realm. The Evil Queen’s home, as well as the forest where she released her curse were appropriately lush and dark. Yet, I had to deduct half a point. It’s distracting when computer animation is obvious, and it was painfully obvious in the fight between the Evil Queen and Maleficent, which probably wouldn’t bother me so much if The Curse and all the other effects weren’t so good by comparison. However, the apples on this show look amazing. I don’t know if they’re real apples, or prop apples, or what, but I’d be curious to find out what their apple budget is, and I’d love to congratulate the person whose job it is to make them look so damn shiny.

Representation (1.5): The women continue to rule the world of this show, and I realized that OUaT totally passes The Bechdel Test! Woo hoo. And we had a bit of improvement in the casting minorities department, with the addition of Giancarlo Esposito (half African-American, half Italian) as Sydney/Magic Mirror, and Latino actor Tony Perez as the Evil Queen’s father. However, the minority actors all seem to be turning up on the side of evil — not as evil characters themselves, mind you, but on the evil side of the story, supporting the story’s villain. I’m trying to not think too much about that. Yet.

Audience Engagement (2): An exciting script, coupled with brilliant performances from the entire cast made this episode one that anyone could enjoy even if they’d missed the pilot and just happened upon it while channel surfing. As for engaging with the audience IRL, cast members have been live-tweeting episodes and Ginnifer Goodwin continues to post really fun behind-the-scenes photos both on Twitter and on the OUaT website.

TOTAL SCORE FOR ONCE UPON A TIME: 9 (out of 10)

 

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Grimm, Ep. 2: “Bears Will Be Bears”

As Nick (David Giuntoli) attempts to protect Aunt Marie (Kate Burton) in the hospital, he and Hank (Russell Hornsby) are assigned to a case in which a young thrillseeker’s boyfriend goes missing after they break into a wealthy family’s home, eat their food, break their stuff, and sleep (and do other stuff) in their bed. We are also introduced to the Jagerbars, bear-like creatures whose males celebrate their coming-of-age through a ritual called Roh-Hatz, which is like a Bar Mitzvah, except with more hunting and disemboweling. Monroe (Silas Weir Mitchell) is brought further into Nick’s life with gruesome consequences (that guy didn’t need that arm anyway), and Captain Renard’s (Sasha Roiz) attempts on Marie’s life are successful, albeit indirectly.

Script (1): This was me watching Grimm this week. While the concept of a family of Jagerbar being The Three Bears was interesting, the rest of the Goldilocks-inspired story fell flat. First, the title card at the beginning with the quote from Goldilocks and The Three Bears? Not necessary. We get it. Or we might’ve gotten it sooner if the episode didn’t start out with a pair of people. Goldilocks didn’t have a boyfriend. The original story was her versus The Bears. It’s in the title. One of the weaknesses of the episode was this unnecessary change that resulted in the boyfriend being the one who is captured and Goldilocks — I mean, Gilda Darner — having to report the crime. Then, because that pulls her out of the story, they suddenly make her vengeful enough to go back to the scene of the crime just so she can be captured herself so the story can move forward. It didn’t make any sense, and it made the story drag. What was successful about the pilot was that the viewer got to see some of the episode from the point of view of the victim and the perpetrator of the crime before Nick and Co. even got to them. We spent part of the episode with Nick and his new ability, and the other part with the scared little girl in the creepy guy’s basement, and the two halves didn’t come together until the end. In “Bears Will Be Bears,” it would’ve been simple, and the story might have moved faster, if Gilda were captured, and we got to see her resentment of the rich revealed as she faced her captors, while her family (or her boyfriend) reports her missing, bringing Nick and Hank into the story. There are additional script issues, but they are pertinent below, so I’ll discuss them there.

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Performances (1.5): While the actors portraying the Rabe Family (the family of Jagerbar) were solid, the actors playing Gilda and her boyfriend were as flat as the script, which is a bad thing when they’re the ones we’re supposed to be rooting for. Most of the regular cast remained solid, but David Giuntoli seems to have trouble with the more demanding aspects of his role. Nick’s aunt, the only family he’s had since he was twelve, dies, and it doesn’t seem to affect Nick much at all. Also, I generally like him and Bitsie Tulloch as Juliette individually, but they had very little chemistry as a couple in this episode. I hope that evolves and gets better, but they spent much of “Bears Will Be Bears” in various stages of making out, and... nothin’. His bromance with Russell Hornsby has much better chemistry.

Production (1.5): The production design of the Rabe Family home, with all its graven bear imagery, was beautiful. The morphing of the fairy tale characters, particularly the jagerbar this week, continue to be believable and effective, and boy did that arm being ripped out look gruesome! Aunt Marie’s trailer, filled with the nick-knacks and doo-dads of her Grimm lifestyle, is a wonderful location that seems at once homey and slightly frightening. I kinda want one of my own. Yes, with all the weapons in it.

Representation (1): The script issues and issues of representation collided in a way I couldn’t ignore. As I mention above, there’s no dramatic reason for Gilda to have a boyfriend with her when she breaks into the home of the “bears.” The original Grimm fairy tale has lasted for hundreds of years on the strength of Goldilocks’ actions alone. Then it dawned on me. Without a boyfriend with her in the house, there’d be no opportunity for this:

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Which is clearly the important thing.

One element of the script that I found interesting was in the character of Mrs. Rabe, the mother of the jagerbar clan. It was predictable that one of the parents would have to be in cahoots with the son, but I was glad that it turned out to be the mother. She actually had a fully-realized guest starring role where we saw the interest she displayed in the artifacts of native cultures foreshadow the intense pride in her own that would allow her to support her son in a violent traditional ritual. It’s sad that one of the most fully-realized female characters on Grimm was a guest star.

Which brings me to Aunt Marie’s death. Last week, I praised the fact that in Grimm, we finally have an example of an older woman guiding a male hero along his path. Except now, that older woman’s been cut down in episode two and replaced by Monroe acting as Nick’s “Grimmipedia.” Now, I love Silas Weir Mitchell, and think Monroe is one of the highlights of Grimm, but would it have been impossible for Nick to have help from both sources? Would it have been detrimental to the show to watch the relationship between Nick and Marie develop? Apparently so, and they’ve replaced her with yet another male character.

And oh, Juliette. I desperately want there to be more to her than meets the eye, but it’s difficult when all she does two episodes in is comfort Nick. And in this episode, when she looks over his shoulder to read his research on bear totem poles and tries to engage him in conversation about what he’s learned, he basically shuts her up by kissing her and telling her she makes it “sound sexy.” Really? This is the woman Nick wants to marry, and he can’t engage in serious conversation with her about something other than her being nurturing for a second?

My hope rests entirely on Adalind Engel, the hexenbeist, who gets more intriguing with every scene she’s in, and seems to be a major part of next week’s episode. While the relationship between her and Captain Renard is unclear, if they weren’t so close in age, I’d be tempted to guess they were father/daughter. As it is, it feels very much like he’s invested in her; like he’s grooming her for something. And while this falls into the tired pattern of Older White Man Leading Young Female to Empowerment, this relationship, as well as her creature-status, means there’s more to her than being young and pretty and a comfort to a man.

But so far, Grimm seems to be a wasteland for female characters.

Once Upon a Time vs. Grimm, Week 2

Audience Engagement (1.5): I watched “Bears Will Be Bears” with a friend who hadn’t seen the pilot, and she was bored to tears. I swore up and down to her that the pilot was so much better! Clearly, this one episode on its own was not enough to engage an audience. As for engaging with the audience IRL, NBC continues to use Twitter to the fullest and has been intelligently using giveaways to promote the show. The cast is friendly and responsive to fans.

TOTAL SCORE FOR GRIMM: 6.5 (out of 10)

 

WEEK 2 WINNER: Once Upon a Time

 

Cumulative Scores So Far:

Once Upon a Time: 17

Grimm: 15

Yowza! I wasn’t expecting quite such a drastic flip from last week! What do you think of my analysis? Let me know in the comments below!

And continue to participate in the conversation next week after you watch Once Upon a Time, which airs Sundays at 8/7 Central on ABC, and Grimm, which airs Fridays at 9/8 Central on NBC.


Teresa Jusino wishes she were as badass as Emma Swan. She can be heard on the popular Doctor Who podcast, 2 Minute Time Lord, participating in a roundtable on Series 6.1. Her “feminist brown person” take on pop culture has been featured on websites like ChinaShopMag.com, PinkRaygun.com, Newsarama, and PopMatters.com. Her fiction has appeared in the sci-fi literary magazine, Crossed Genres; she is the editor of Beginning of Line, the Caprica fan fiction site; and her essay “Why Joss is More Important Than His ‘Verse” is included in Whedonistas: A Celebration of the Worlds of Joss Whedon By the Women Who Love Them, which is on sale now wherever books are sold! 2012 will see Teresa’s work in an upcoming non-fiction sci-fi anthology. Get Twitterpated with Teresa,“like” her on Facebook, or visit her at The Teresa Jusino Experience.

23 comments
David Thomson
1. ZetaStriker
The weakness of a procedural will only continue to set the two apart from here on out, so long as the writing remains good for Once Upon a Time. Grimm had a good pilot, but I don't think the metaplot will be strong enough to compete with Once Upon a Time outside maybe a gripping season finale or two. I'm hoping the next episode can prove me wrong, however, and not focus on a "crime of the week" but on the assaults on Nick's family.

As for Once Upon a Time, the pilot sounded rather dull, especially after coming off of Fables. The news from the second episode has me excited to go back and check out both episodes now though, so I guess I will be watching both after all.
Chris Long
2. radynski
It may be a procedural, but procedurals work where genre shows fail, because people like procedurals. Two episodes in and I still expect Grimm to long outlast OUAT.

If I had to pick which one worked better for the week, I'd still go with Grimm, although I liked OUAT much better this week than the first. The real problem for me is the writing on OUAT. That conversation between the two witches in flashback was so bad I nearly changed the channel right then.

"No, you can't use the really bad curse! It's just too evil!" Their whole scene sounded like a twelve-year-old wrote it.
OrangeXIII
3. OrangeXIII
Aside from the issues raised here, I'm having a hard time justifying Marie's decision wait this long to tell Nick anything. Considering one can always drop dead or get killed unexpectedly, you would think she would have given him a heads up, or at least gotten him some martial arts training or something.
Teresa Jusino
4. TeresaJusino
OrangeXIII @3 - that always happens in stories like this, though. Doesn't make it any less annoying, but still - people keeping people ignorant to "keep them safe." Not realizing of course that keeping them ignorant can be even more dangerous. I understand her decision. I don't agree with it, but I get it.

radynski @2 - I think that has a lot to do with that being the fairytale half though. The dialogue in those scenes is purposely supposed to sound like it's in a children's book. That makes sensse to me. Though I must admit, that scene was hella campy. However, once they got to the problem of the curse, and Maleficent got serious, I thought the writing was appropriate for the kind of scene it was.

Zetastriker @1 - I still have hope for the metaplot of Grimm with regard to Captain Renard and the hexenbeist. Clearly, they had beef w/Marie from way back, and now that she's gone, they'll be coming for Nick next. Or, alternately, try to incorporate him into their fold. Not sure which yet. Because if they wanted to end that line of Grimms, they would've tried to kill him, too. So my guess is that they need him for something, and they needed Marie out of the way in order to make it happen.
rick gregory
5. rickg
er... I'm confused. Ep 2 of Once Upon A Time aired a week ago. Last night was ep 3, "Snow Falls."

That aside, I'm curious to see how OUAT turns into an ongoing series without artificially stretching things out. At some point Emma needs to start believing Henry (though this can't happen too easily or we it will feel fake... after all what Henry's saying IS unbelievable and much easier to explain as a psychological phenomenon). However, once Emma does start believing him and the battle starts, it can't really drag on past S1. I mean, there's only two basic resolutions to this... the prophecy of Emma overturning the curse is true and she and the other good characters win or it's not and they lose. There are obvious variations (they win but are trapped here...) but... meh.

This seems to me to run the risk that Heroes did in its first season... you resolve the immediate storyline and then... what? In OUAT's case, once the Evil Queen is defeated, you've lost the basic storyline. Sure, they can do the old "we've won, but things don't just pickup where they left off" (for example, what happens to Emma and Henry who've never lived in the alternate world?) but the essential conflict here is "Evil Queen feels wronged by Snow, curses her world to live in ours and forget. Prophesied kid comes along, defeats EQ. The End." As a miniseries, that works. As an open ended one?
OrangeXIII
6. Stefan Jones
I was so turned off by the "Once Upon a Time" pilot that I wrote it off. There are only so many shows one can follow, right?

What gave me the eye rolls: To all appearances, the fantasy world was Disney Tapioca fantasy. Watered down hardly-budges-from-the-formula warmed-over Snow White / Sleeping Beauty vanilla pudding.

I guess I'll have to look for a repeat and give it another try.

And wow, Giancarlo Esposito? Anyone who has watched the last season of Breaking Bad is going to twitch a bit when he comes on.
Jeremy Goff
7. JeremyM
The flashbacks on OUAT are still to corny for me. They were a lot better this week than last week, but everything in them just doesn't look right to me especially the computer animation. I know that's not a great argument, but I really can't place my finger on why I dislike them so much. So far that's my only major complaint with this show, but for me it's a pretty big one. Everything else about it I've loved so far.

I thought this weeks Grimm was good. I really enjoyed the Goldilocks story and there was no magic iPod to help them solve the case this week which was good. As far as the whole Goldilocks' boyfriend not being in the original story I can see why that would bug people, but it's just like any other time they move a story between mediums. There's some things they ellaboroate on, some things they drop, and others that are completely new to the story. This has never been a big hot button for me because I expect that. They're not trying to tell the story exactly as it was written. They're telling a rendition of it, and in this case it's a stylized/sexualized version of it, and without the boyfriend you can't have that. You're right though the story would have moved a lot quicker without him. The girl playing Gilda's acting was pretty bad as well. The scene where she's crying at the police station was pretty hard for me to watch.
Melanie S
8. starryharlequin
rickg@5, I think Teresa wants to compare episode 2 of Grimm to episode 2 of OUaT--but Grimm started almost a week after OUaT and then she has to write these long and very detailed posts! So we're about a week behind OUaT.

A general question--was there something indicating kid-Harry was her father, or was he just named for him? I thought it was the latter but the post seems to indicated the former (although I could have misread). And I was knitting so I might have missed onscreen cues!
rick gregory
9. rickg
There wasn't anything to indicate Henry was actually EQ's father but you wonder of course.
What gave me the eye rolls: To all appearances, the fantasy world was Disney Tapioca fantasy. Watered down hardly-budges-from-the-formula warmed-over Snow White / Sleeping Beauty vanilla pudding.
Er... well... it IS. It's playing on what viewers know of those stories which is mostly the Disneyfied versions of them. If they altered the characters too much you'd have people complain about THAT.

Starry... I see what you meant... I was just confused since Teresa didn't note that in the post so I was wondering.
Teresa Jusino
10. TeresaJusino
And starryharlequin for the win! :) Originally, Grimm was supposed to premiere the same week as OUaT, but then they changed their premiere date to Halloween weekend. So this would've worked a lot better had they stuck to that, but NBC never asked me. :) Still, since Grimm airs after OUaT, it's still that same week's "Episode 2." Ep 2 of OUaT aired last Sunday, Ep 2 of Grimm aired on Friday, and I review them both on Monday. That's the schedule. Hope that makes sense. So Ep. 3 of OUaT will be reviewed after Ep 3 of Grimm airs this Friday.

Stefan Jones @6 - I disagree! This is no Disney Snow White. Yes, she has her prince, but she's also pulling a sword at her wedding, and is basically the one in charge of all the decision making in the relationship. She's willing to make deals with shady characters to protect her unborn child. She's got a stronger set of ovaries than Disney's Snow White ever did! :)

JeremyM @ - the problem I had with the boyfriend wasn't that they changed the original story. After all, they were changing the original story by inventing jaegerbar and setting it in the modern world, etc. But the boyfriend had no dramatic reason for being there. What's worse, his being there actually hurt the story by forcing scenes to be added to bring the Goldilocks stand-in back into the story. I have no problems with stories being modernized/re-told/changed so long as there's a reason for the change, or the additions/changes are innovative ones that make for a new, interesting, exciting story. Having him in this episode made the episode worse than it would've been without him.
OrangeXIII
11. StrongDreams
I'd like to see Grimm move out of the northern European (mostly Germanic, it seems) fairy tale tradition and introduce some creatures from elsewhere. Gaiman's American Gods did a good job of bringing in myths and legends from all over the world. There are lots of good potential creatures from Africa, South America, China, etc.
Adrian J.
12. LightningStorm
I seem to be the only one who thinks Once Upon a Time is the by far superior show. Sure it has it's flaws, but compared to Grimm it is leaps and bounds better.

Also, for the arm severing scene in Grimm. I was like WTF, arms do not detach that easily and wasn't even in the slightest gruesome to me. It was in fact terribly cartoony... like Bugs Bunny Cartoony. Now I realize this being NBC we wouldn't get an excess of blood, that's fine but even considering that the whole thing was just bad IMO.

To me the only thing Grimm has on Once Upon a Time is that is is more consistent in its quality. I thought the first episode of Grimm was just OK and the 2nd one was too. Once Upon a Time though I thought the first episode was good and the second was amazing and the third (which I realize we aren't talking about just yet) was just decent.

Also, side note, I agree about how Grimm started with the boyfriend. I immediately thought "oh they're doing Hansel and Gretel" (but changing the brother/sister relationship to that of a boyfriend/girlfriend), but then realized that's not what was happening and was totally pulled out of the story because of the awkwardness of the rest of the plot.

*late edit. got my networks flip flopped
Jenny Thrash
13. Sihaya
I can see why Grimm's story mechanics require Goldilocks to have an accomplice. If Gilda went missing on her own (even if her backstory is altered) it would be weeks before somebody else noticed she was gone, which would motivate one to think that either she was dead or that, wow, this would be the second hostage kept "fresh" on the show in as many weeks. If Gilda was on her own and escaped, she shouldn't be motivated to come forward and say, "I broke into a really scary rich guy's house." If she escaped and was caught drunk driving (like she is in the show), and said, "No really, *they attacked me,*" then something in her story might motivate our intrepid Grimm, but he wouldn't have enough evidence or urgency to use the resources of the police department. Instead Gilda is able to assert that she left someone behind, pushing the motivation for the plot onto at least some level of possibility. She doesn't return for revenge, either; she tries to rescue her partner/boyfriend, which was the writers' admittedly clunky, but certainly assertive, way of sticking her back into the Goldilocks role.

As for why her accomplice had to be a boyfriend? Well, there I think you're entirely on the mark.

I was entirely unsurprised that the mother is in cahoots with the son. Bears are matriarchal. Everybody knows that. ;) Alright, alright - most societies that are wrapped up in bear mythology or bear worship are perceived as generally matrilineal, if not matriarchal. I don't know if the perception is entirely true, but it seems to me that this story relies on it. I was actually chuckling as I watched Mrs. Rabe bristle when her husband told Nick about how they don't do that old stuff anymore. He figured they were a modern family of monsters who weren't all stuck in their violent old gender normative roles. Momma thought she'd show him his place, is my guess. I'm glad that his son will survive to fight the dominance of the Jagerbar matriarchy.

And I thought the episode was generally effective at making us think about gender roles by flipping them. The leading assassin in the story arc is a female. The hotheaded scoundrel/hero in the monster of the week story is a woman. Nick knows he can't win by shooting his way through a situation, so he's got to talk to the Rabes, but his aunt probably would have "killed everyone and let God sort the rest."

I think of Nick's aunt as the equivelent of Uncle Barnabus at the beginning of John Bellaires's book The House With the Clock in Its Walls. Nick knows her a bit, but by the time he entered her care, he was old enough, and she was already so mired in the work of Grimming, that she probably seemed like nothing more than the eccentric old aunt who kept him at arms' length. Unlike THWTCIW's Barnabus, Marie made the decision to maintain the status quo when her nephew came to live with her. I can see how it makes Nick less accessible to us, but alot of people really do have pretty close relatives whose death would leave them grieving - at a distance. I have a feeling that Marie preferred it that way, since she's already told Nick that he really ought to avoid emotional entanglement. I also suspect she's not entirely gone.
OrangeXIII
14. Lsana
I must admit that I really didn't care for this week's Grimm. I was kind of lukewarm on last week's, so take that for what it's worth, but this week had me, likethe poster's friend, bored to tears. The big problem I think was the fact that in every version of the Goldilocks story I've read, Goldilocks is the villain. The bears are her innocent victims. And I think the pattern held here. I didn't care what happened to these two bratty teenagers. My only question was why the bears hadn't eaten them yet.

The metaplot was better, I thought, but I don't know if it's enough to keep my interest. Aunt Marie was badass, even dying of cancer and stab wounds and toxins and who knows what else. But given that she's gone, so is that reason to watch the show. I'll probably give Grimm another week before giving up on it.

I'm not sure whether Once Upon a Time is better from a technical perspective, but it has succeeded in getting me to care about Emma and Henry and Regina. I enjoyed seeing Regina's backstory, and I want to know more about her and Mr. Gold. It does seem like the sort of show, that can't last forever, but I'm okay with that. I want to see where it goes.
Liz Bourke
15. hawkwing-lb
I'm really in love with Once Upon A Time: it's both delightfully camp and at the same time has darker, emotionally real undertones. It's wonderful to see a show where all the driving adult personalities are women, and I have to say? The Evil Queen is brilliantly played.

I gave up on Grimm after one point five episodes. I wanted to like it. But it's just falling flat - the only character I found engaging was Aunt Marie, since Nick is so blandly two-dimensional. (Juliette barely has one dimension.)
Bob Blough
16. Bob
I enjoyed week two of Once Upun a Time much better than Grimm this week - but I have to agree that OUAT may make a great season (such as Heroes first season was great as an entitity all it's own) I don't think it can continue if they stretch it out too much. Grimm may last longer but it was a very week episode this week. I'll see what happens on week three. Grimm was my favorite pilot but OUAT wins the second round.
OrangeXIII
17. Tara D
With OUAT, I hope the show's creators and producers are smart and don't draw it out too long. I think this is the problem with a lot of American shows. The show should go for about three or four seasons, but networks want to make them ten seasons long. They need to leave on a high note instead of being cancelled because it gets to bogged down.
OrangeXIII
18. aggle
While I agree that this week's Grimm was pretty weak, I disagree that Goldilocks having a boyfriend was a problem. Furthermore, I disagree with your implication that all the Grimm episodes should follow their fairy tale inspirations as closely as possible. I liked that the story was more Goldilocks-inspired than Goldilocks copied. Goldilocks out for blood was at least a refreshing new idea, rather than a rehash of the same old story we all know by heart.

And secondly, of course Aunt Marie had to die! They established it in the pilot that the Grimms' abilities begin transferring around the death of the elder family member. Monroe asks Nick, "Is someone in your family dying?" as if it's the most obvious thing in the world. I agree that there is a disappointing lack of strong female cast members, but Marie's death is required by the plot so there's no use complaining about it.
OrangeXIII
19. DebraLC
Enough with the analysis. I'll take Grimm. Why? Because it left me wanting more and Once Upon A Time just left me feeling blah.
OrangeXIII
20. PJP
Enjoyed Once Upon a Time (despite the hokeyness). Very weird and unusual. I've never seen anything like this before.

On the other hand, I never made it past the first episode of Grimm. All the snarling monster faces and dumb-looking monsters that are supposed to be scary but aren't. It was just so cliche and predictable. Nothing new. Nothing fresh. Complete garbage.

I thought Once Upon a Time was garbage too. Only reason I bothered watching it was because it was on Hulu for free. It was a pleasant surprise, though it does have its flaws.
Teresa Jusino
21. TeresaJusino
aggle @18 - I'm not complaining that Marie's death has to happen, I'm complaining that it happened in episode TWO! I know she has to die for him to fully come into his own, but the entire SEASON could be about his growth and weaning himself off needing her. She didn't have to die right away to stay true to the mythology. And she could've been both a teacher to him, and a foil for Monroe. Keeping her around would've made things more interesting.

And actually, I didn't imply that the stories have to stick closely to the fairy tale at all. What I said was that I thought this particular choice (the boyfriend) was dramatically weak, and therefore unnecessary as a change. The show is set in modern times, and Grimm's creators invented the jagerbar and the Roh-Hatz ritual, which I thought were really interesting takes on the three bears. It's just the boyfriend that put the bee in my bonnet.

Debra LC @19 - I'm actually going to be doing the analysis the whole season. Sorry you're bored already! :) But seriously, feel free to participate here on the Grimm side of things! You can ignore Once all together, if you'd like.
Teresa Jusino
22. TeresaJusino
sihaya @13 - something I meant to ask you earlier....why do you think it would take weeks for someone to notice she was gone? There's where the boyfriend could've come in. If she had a boyfriend she lived with, and she didn't come home one night, nor the next day, he would've reported it. Easy-peasy.

It just bothered me, because it seemed like the only reason the Grimm writers had her have a boyfriend is so that they could have sex in the bed and they could 1) show Gilda in her underwear, and 2) say "they did more than sleep in my bed!" It just seemed silly and unnecessary, but what do I know?
Jenny Thrash
23. Sihaya
Teresa @22: Goldilocks/Gilda was set up as a migrant of sorts who's prone to petty crime and bad decisions. The character suits the narrative logic, for sure. That's also the sort of person who can be gone for weeks without anybody calling the police. Since she's an adult, the police wouldn't necessarily put her missing status on the front burner, either, not if somebody didn't witness her being kidnapped. Now, if the boyfriend had escaped the house and Gilda had been left behind, the plot could have broken the same way, but our Grimm (and therefore the audience) gets more time to interact with her this way, especially since the show rarely breaks away from Nick's POV.

But like I said, I completely agree that the reason the writers chose a boyfriend (instead of a brother, a simple criminal partner, or whatever) was for the exact reason you state - showing Gilda getting busy in her underwear. And no, that part wasn't necessary at all.

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