Apr 8 2010 5:10pm

An Email Conversation I Had Yesterday

From: Jennifer Liang
To: Leigh Butler
Cc: Jason Denzel

Subject: Favor?

Hi Leigh!

I'm sure you've been too busy to notice, what with all the moving and recapping and whatnot lately, but Suvudu has been running a fantasy character deathmatch series, and our boy Rand al’Thor is in the final round against Jamie Lannister from A Song of Ice and Fire. And Jason and I have pretty much decided we will die of shame if Rand loses this.

If you could put an announcement about it in your next re-read post and ask people to go vote for Rand before voting closes April 11th, we would be much obliged.



From: Jason Denzel
To: Leigh Butler
Cc: Jennifer Liang

Subject: Re: Favor?

I'll take it a step further....

Leigh, how about a dedicated blog post about it on

Because I will, by Zeus's left toe, bash my head through a wall if Jaime freaking Lannister defeats Rand.

Please, Leigh. For my head, and the wall's sake.


From: Jennifer Liang
To: Leigh Butler
Cc: Jason Denzel

Subject: Re: Favor?

For reals. A guy who can erase people from existence shouldn't be losing ANYTHING.

Well, maybe the hand.


From: Leigh Butler
To: Jason, Jennifer

Subject: Re: Favor?

Heh. Consider it done.

Barry T
1. blindillusion
Already voted for Rand. But this is amusing as hell.

I'm going to hate explaining to my CO why there is coffee all over the new government laptop.

Good one, Leigh.

Hoping everyone votes for Rand.

edit: Got number 1 on two WOT related posts in one day.... I guess I owe the Army some money now 'cause it's obvious I'm not working today.

Oh well...all our tax dollars.... =)
James Jones
2. jamesedjones
Dangit, Jason! Now I'll be voting for Jaime with glee (and a little shame).

Edit: Umm... Go Light! Heh.
Bonnie Andrews
3. misfortuona
Vote now and vote often as a certain Floridian friend of mine says. **Hi Tek** Waves

I too have already put in my ballot for our man Rand, but yes Please in the name of Heads and Hearts everywhere vote at work, vote at home, head to your local library, or internet cafe.


JDJ For Shame, Darkfriend!!!
Henry Loose
4. schrodinger
i've been monitoring the vote. Rand is winning, his largest margin was around 560, now its hovering around 415 and has been all day. The best part is explaining to people why their scenarios will never work, and then trying to make them work. Rand FTW.
Marcus W
5. toryx
jamesedjones @ 2:

*laugh* That was the first thing I thought when I saw this post too. Can't help it, I've always had a liking for the underdog.
Sam Mickel
6. Samadai

Just remember, according to, Rand is the underdog.
Elio García
7. Egarcia
Oi, partisanship!

Now, even in the quoted e-mails, you see the usual fallback of Rand's supporters: balefire! It all comes down to balefire.

It's outré! It's cheap! It's scandalous!

(To be fair, Brandon puts forward a more nuanced argument in his write-up, and does not lean on the balefire crutch so very much.)

Let me then put forward the argument for why one might to consider Jaime in this competition:

1) Because he's awesome. Long-time Lovecraft afficando GRRM puts forward a mighty plausible way for just how Jaime could win a fight against Cthulhu, which is very clever, true to the source (and, I suspect, to quite a few sessions of Call of Cthulhu in days of yore).

2) Because his friends will make him yet more awesome. Rand has graciously (or arrogantly, depending on your perspective) allowed Jaime his six allies, drawn from the worlds and works of GRRM's imagination.

What man, demon, or god can hope to stand against the likes of a Hrangan Mind, Haviland Tuf, or (*gulp*) the Great and Powerful Turtle? Though perhaps Tyrion has other individuals in mind...

3) Did I mention he's awesome? And oh so handsome, and as we all know, dashing good looks goes a long way in any battle...

(Okay, that point may not be very serious. All the rest are deadly serious, I tell you! Deadly! Serious!)
Nathan Martin
8. lerris
I don't see how Rand can possibly lose, unless the One Power fails him.

As a fan of both series, I naturally voted for the character whose writer shows greater dedication to finishing the series for his readers. That being Rand of course.
P Bradley Robb
9. knownhuman
The Suvudu write up seems to have confused Rand for Aang the Airbender.

Now that's a match worth seeing.
Pam K
10. PamK
I think that Brandon Sanderson's point about the tendency of GRRM's characters to die bloody deaths wins the argument.

OTOH, if Jaime dresses in drag, he might have a chance.
Jason Denzel
11. JasonDenzel
Ok, first off, just so we're crystal clear, I'm not a GRRM hater. I have a profound respect for GRRM's work and his characters.

But, ya know... come on. You know who's team I play for. :)

BTW - I think GRRM was misinformed on something. I don't know who it was, but somebody other than Brandon "replied on Rand's behalf". I don't know who it was, but unless it was somebody employed by Team Jordan, I consider it a non-valid reply.

If it is, I hereby officially respond on Jaime Lannister's behalf and, I um, forfeit.
Jason Denzel
12. JasonDenzel
PS... Leigh... I'm never emailing you again.

Like. Ever.
Leigh Butler
13. leighdb

But it was just too funny not to share!
Samuel Walker
14. lambada
Indeed, I too have been totally mystified at who accepted GRRMs challenge.

I think the challenge as it was stated was perfectly fair - 7v7. (even if I did think the point of a cage match was 1v1).

But seriously, I don't think anyone but Team Jordan / Brandon has the right to accept said challenge whilst also making it 7v1.

From what I could gather, Brandon was away from his e-mail from a few days - hence him missing the challenge.

Now, I understand suvudu needed a response to this challenge before voting opened. And I could understand them accepting the challenge as it was written - 7v7.

What I cannot understand is that, barring any mean spirited fan (of either series), how it got turned into a 7v1.

Either way, we all know Rand will win, but Rands response reeks of foul play to me.
Jason Denzel
15. JasonDenzel
Rand might be winning right now, but as soon as GRRM posts his interpretation of how the battle goes, he's going to get an up-swing in votes.

But there are always Plans Within Plans™.
Thomas Keith
16. insectoid
LOL... too funny Leigh!!

Blind @1:
I'm going to hate explaining to my CO why there is coffee all over the new government laptop.
I have a solution for that...

Jennifer Liang
17. JenniferL
I don't know why Jason is complaining. We're funny as hell. =)
Gabriele Campbell
18. G-Campbell
Sorry, but I like Jaime better than Rand, so I'll vote for him. :P
Tricia Irish
19. Tektonica
Come on, team Light! Jaime Lannister might be an intriguing character, but he is a scumbag!

We need Rand around to save the freaking WORLD.

I tried to vote on my husbands computer too, but we have the same ISP and so it didn't work....have to hit the local Starbucks, I guess.

As Mis pointed out above, I'm from of the hanging Chad....

Vote now and vote often!

Go Rand!
20. peachy
@10 - Well, that's my strategy. If Tyrion can figure out Cthulhu's hidden weakness, then he can figure out Rand's. (Not that either is very well hidden, of course.) And really, it's just a twist on the "ride a mare in heat against a guy on a stallion" stratagem. True, that was the Tyrell kid - but if the Knight of Flowers, paragon of chivalry etc etc, is willing to do something like that, think what the freakin' Lannisters would do to win!

Poor Rand.
Fake Name
21. ThePendragon
Since Jennifer doesn't seem to mind, I propose that from now on you post all of your correspondence with her on here.
Marcus W
22. toryx
Now Tektonica, if you go and cheat, I'll really have to vote for Jaime just to cancel out the cheating. Because that'd be wrong!
Tricia Irish
23. Tektonica
Oh please! This is a silly cage match between fictional characters!

Besides, I haven't been able to .....yet.....
24. Freelancer
Four computers at home, one router. If only I knew how to . . . oh wait, I do.

And there are plenty of different computers at work I can log into with unique IDs.

Lannister is scum. He isn't even a real hero. This is a guy who lives for his own appetites, and if what he does turns out for the good it's a pure accident.

Rand, OTH, he's carrying that mountain no matter how heavy it gets. He does what he believes it right, no matter how costly or painful to himself. Right there is the definition of honor.

How can you like the cheezeball more than the honorable guy? Yeah, I spent years asking girls that very question, until I met the one who didn't.
Jacy Clark
25. Amalisa
lol@Tek re "hanging chad"!

*points at Freelancer* What he said...

And I voted for Rand, of course!
Rob Munnelly
26. RobMRobM
@24. An interesting part of ASoIF is how characters are allowed to turn shades of gray - and, not to spoil things for the nonreaders (to date) but Jaime gets more interesting as the books progress. At a certain point, I can no longer classify him as "scum," I don't see him ruled by his appetites, and I don't see the good that he's doing (and he does some good) being an accident at all. A character can be known by the friends he keeps and, as of a certain part of the books, his relationship with his very unusual mentee shows his growth as a character. Now Cersei on the other hand....
27. mats3rdcousin
I like asoiaf as much as the next person, but voting for jaime Lannister? Thats like hoping the worst person you know will win the lottery.
Maggie M
28. Eswana
@ Freelancer "How can you like the cheezeball more than the honorable guy? Yeah, I spent years asking girls that very question, until I met the one who didn't."

THAT'S ADORABLE. Awww. Gold star.

And yes, I voted for Rand, of course! Both on my computer at home and at work!
29. Fridadesai
Great detailed information, I ll be visiting you more frequently, here is very interesting information.

Best Attorney
Philbert de Zwart
30. philbert
The term 'hand to hand combat' gets a whole different meaning.

BTW, the picture of Rand bites wind. He even has 2 hands in that pic.
a a-p
31. lostinshadow
Ahh as of friday morning Eastern time, Rand is ahead by less than 400 votes...

the gap is closing people! keep voting
32. Soloce
People really shouldn't cheat. It's not fair and ruins the point of the match. People who cheat don't get any COOKIES for dinner. If my kids cheated, I would DELETE THEIR COOKIES from the cookie jar as a punishment. If that didn't work, I'd think of other TEMPORARY measures to implement. As a last resource, I'd look for other parenting techniques, BROWSING in one store or ANOTHER ONE.

You cheaters suck.
Marcus W
33. toryx
I agree wholeheartedly that Rand is absolutely the better man (though like RobM, Jaime has really grown on me in the last couple of books -- that's one of the things that I love about aSoIaF, characters can change dramatically). I also think that as the savior of all the worlds, he should definitely win the cage match. Not to mention that, as a channeler, he definitely has the edge over Jaime no matter how many guys Tyrion brings to the fight.

On the other hand, the desperate pleas of "Vote for Rand, vote often, he's gotta win!" combined with the "Don't be silly, it's only a game" when people are going out of their way to cheat turns me off. I was going to vote for Rand for all the reasons I listed in the first paragraph but ended up casting the vote the other way as a result. Sorry...flashbacks to high school make me erratic and irresponsible.

Rest assured, however, that I'm not going out of my way to find other IP addresses to pad the vote, so my one vote for the wrong person isn't going to make a difference.
Tess Laird
34. thewindrose
Leigh - you are very sneaky, I am sure Jason will not be able to not e-mail you again;)

Goes without thought - I voted for Rand of course, like all the other times:)

Tina Murrah
35. Tina.Murrah
My only thought is that dont they both lose thier sword hands? Who is arranging handicapped death matches?

Richard Boye
36. sarcastro
Oy, such a dilemna!

On the one hand, we have Rand who can zorch a fortress from across a meadow and go home without cracking a sweat.

On the other hand, we have Jaime, who can't. He was supposedly the knightliest of knights in his prime, though.

On another set of hands, Jaime only has one hand. Actually, correction, Rand also has one hand now. Hmmm. Jaime replaced his missing hand with a golden simlacrum, though, with mother-of-pearl nails. Rand has a healed stub that truncates his tattoo. Hmm. Style points to Jaime.

Rand has a trio of interesting, powerful, beautiful consorts, only one of whom is arguably power-crazed. Jaime has his sister, who is ostensibly gorg-jeese (but going to fat) but inarguably crazy. Plus, she's also his sister. (Let's not get into whether Rand and Elayne are cousins, shall we - we know they're not, but there are heretics who won't believe). Points to Rand.

Rand is hard as stone and sticks to his word. Jaime sorta kinda sticks to his word, but has a flexibility to him that allows him to adhere to the principle, but sort of weasel around the point. Hmm. Rand, prevails.

However, Jaime is a joy to read, conflicted, wry, and occasionally dropping off acid comments and bon mots. Rand is a torment soul who literally nears the weight of the world on his shoulders... and it shows. Jaime FTW!

I have decided.
Tricia Irish
37. Tektonica
Jaime is starting to move towards redemption....I'm reserving judgement on his character.....remains to be seen just how far he comes....and he has a long way to go. Ick. And yeah, Cersei....baaaad, baaaad, baaaad.

Toryx, I'm sorry my attempts at enthusiasm and humor gave you a high school flashback....and sorry you voted for, erm, that other admitted it, Be mad at me if you want, but don't take it out on poor old Rand, Savior of the World.

Geez.....Can't we even joke around? Is everything a deep moral dilemma?

FWIW: I have cast one vote. For Rand.
James Jones
38. jamesedjones
FWIW: I casted 2 for Rand (home and work). It would suck if he lost, but a video of Jason and a random wall would really ease the pain.

Edit: Maybe we could allow a football helmet in the match between Jason and the wall.
Marcus W
39. toryx
Tektonica @ 37:

I'm not criticizing you directly, nor am I angry at you. I'm just amused and a little turned off by the...passion...that this silly little game is stirring up. I'm also playing the straight guy (humor wise) and that doesn't work that well online.

It's cool that people are having so much fun with it.
40. Freelancer

Well, I believe people should have to register their identification when voting for truly stupid contests, like American Idol. But no, brainless dweebs can vote as much as they like for the less talented contestants and send the deserving ones packing. Those are real humans, this is a virtual fight among fictional characters. Your umbrage is duly noted with all worthy consideration. While I find more untapped locations from which to vote on suvudu. ::wink::

Update: Rand by exactly 500. My vote(s) is not the reason he leads. If it were, I would feel...
Matthew Smith
41. blocksmith
First off, I can't even believe this vote is close.

Seriously, Rand create lightning that literally tracks down and annilihates shadowspawn. Did some of these people not read Dumai's Wells? Can you say Rolling Fire and Earth? Rand can do that in his sleep.

Seriously, the only way Rand gets touched is if he takes a second to decide whether to turn Jaime Lanister into a scorch mark shaped like an arm pit or smear depicting a slug. Recall that Rand took a spear through his side from the Left Hand of the DO and, not only fried his behind but lived to tell of it.

I am on my way to vote now...can't allow this travesty to continue.
44. darkkillerx
didnt see matt in the tournament unfotunately, he could've gone far i think. Probably really far since he is good with a staff, is a military genius with all the memories, is a very lucky person, and has a no magic shell around him.
Elio García
45. Egarcia
GRRM's provided his write-up, with some fun for fans of WoT and ASoIaF alike, and there's a tribute to RJ there which I hope will help remind folks that this is all just fun and games, and maybe cheating or talking about killing people who vote the other way is at least a wee bit beyond over the top. ;)

Also a nod to Zelazny, which is very awesome indeed.

Myself, I had expected Tuf to take Popinjay out to some airless rock in the middle of interstellar space, let him out in an EVA suit so he could get really familiar with it ... and then return him to the tourney ground, where *pop* Rand ends up on said airless rock.

Oh, he'd open a Skimming gate in a split second before his blood boils in the vacuum of space ... but how long does it take to travel a few scores of light years by Skimming, I wonder? Forfeit!

A very cheap victory, though. I like GRRM's take better.
46. drunes
Voted for Rand, although I'm angry he lists Locke Lamora as a kill and will like to see Rand go now, too. Still, Jaime is such a punk... if he ever crossed paths with Locke, there'd be no reason for the final books Martin has yet to write, it'd be over.
Marcus W
47. toryx
Just read GRRM's writing. Whether you prefer Rand or Jaime, it's masterfully written. Granted, there are a few mistakes (namely misspelling Aviendha) but I think it's a splendid homage to Jordan's writing style and I love the notion that the Creator for all these worlds is the Writer.

Regardless of one's opinion of GRRM as a writer, he's taken to this silly game with a great deal of good spirit.
Thomas Pluim
48. pluiminator
Just checked the poll Rand is ahead ... by 11, so voting would definitely be a good idea.

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